泰戈尔《飞鸟集》一句诗句误译的分析和对翻译的启示

wherestip wrote:



Well. that's your opinion. And like I said a few years ago, you are always entitled to it no matter what.

nigerose wrote:



有时候not...because = ...not because，这并不是我的opinion，而是英语语法的事实（fact）。

这叫否定前移。就像不能说I think you are not right, 而应该说I don't think you are right。

wherestip wrote:



I don't need a lecture from you. Call it what you want, your English level IS what it is.

Zhoudan wrote:

请不要乱引

Nigerose,

我的话明明针对的是你的那段圣经引语，跟老孙的这个例子完全没有关系。请不要这样随意歪曲我的话。

ysun wrote:


小周的话确实是被歪曲了。小周的原帖与我那帖根本就没有任何关系。不能根据自己的需要，把小周的话和我的帖子硬凑在一起。这种做法，不是实事求是的做法，也不是正常的辩论手法。在小周说了“请不要乱引”之后，还坚持说“我想我并没有乱引用”，那就更不应该。因此，我不得不再说上这几句。那段圣经引语与我帖子中所提到的泰戈尔诗句 “Do not seat your love upon a precipice because it is high” ，从表面上看似乎相似，但根本就不是同一句型。机械地套用句型和语法就难免得出错误的结论。

nigerose wrote:

为了澄清事实，再说一句：

和合本 箴24:19不要为作恶的心怀不平，也不要嫉妒恶人， KJV
英 箴24:19Fret not thyself because of evil [men], neither be thou envious at the wicked; NIV
英 箴24:19Do not fret because of evil men or be envious of the wicked,
吕振中 箴24:19不要为了作恶的而心怀不平；不要羡慕恶人；
新译本 箴24:19不要因作恶的人心怀不平，也不要嫉妒恶人。
现代译 箴24:19不要因作恶的人得意而心怀不平；不要羡慕他们。
当代译 箴24:19不要因恶人的所为而忿忿不平，也不要羡慕他；
思高本 箴24:19对作恶的人，你不要动怒；对乖戾之徒，也不必嫉妒；
文理本 箴24:19勿缘为非者而烦扰、勿于作恶者生嫉妒、

http://bible.kuanye.net/old/z/652.htm

比较：
Do not fret because of evil men
&
Do not seat your love upon a precipice because it is high

相同：not...because = ... not because 否定前移
不同之处仅在于because of接名词，because接从句。

wherestip wrote:

There are plenty of English sentences that use the word "because" to choose from. The sentence you're quoting has nothing in common construction-wise with the original sentence in discussion.

Your game of quoting Biblical admonishments to insult others is nothing new. Be careful 'cause there have been precedents of people getting kicked off this site who tried it.


[Edited at 2012-06-18 01:14 GMT]

nigerose wrote:

您老请息怒，也请不要对号入座。

nigerose wrote:

我的目的仅在讨论语法，不在句子所表达的具体内容。
我暂时只能找到这个权威性句子，而且有点遗憾的是它用because of而不是because，不过实质是相同的。

我都下定决心以后不再讨论什么问题了。浪费时间，影响心情。

...

As Christians, we must be very careful to make intelligent and informed decisions about what translations of the Bible we choose to read. On the liberal extreme, we have people who would give us heretical new translations that attempt to change God’s Word to make it politically correct. One example of this, which has made headlines recently is the Today’s New International Version (T.N.I.V.) which seeks to remove all gender-specific references in the Bible whenever possible! Not all new translations are good… and some are very bad.

But equally dangerous, is the other extreme… of blindly rejecting ANY English translation that was produced in the four centuries that have come after the 1611 King James. We must remember that the main purpose of the Protestant Reformation was to get the Bible out of the chains of being trapped in an ancient language that few could understand, and into the modern, spoken, conversational language of the present day. William Tyndale fought and died for the right to print the Bible in the common, spoken, modern English tongue of his day… as he boldly told one official who criticized his efforts, “If God spare my life, I will see to it that the boy who drives the plowshare knows more of the scripture than you, Sir!”

Will we now go backwards, and seek to imprison God’s Word once again exclusively in ancient translations? Clearly it is not God’s will that we over-react to SOME of the bad modern translations, by rejecting ALL new translations and “throwing the baby out with the bathwater”. The Word of God is unchanging from generation to generation, but language is a dynamic and ever-changing form of communication. We therefore have a responsibility before God as Christians to make sure that each generation has a modern translation that they can easily understand, yet that does not sacrifice accuracy in any way. Let’s be ever mindful that we are not called to worship the Bible. That is called idolatry. We are called to worship the God who gave us the Bible, and who preserved it through the centuries of people who sought to destroy it.

wherestip wrote:



You are way off on a lark. No one is so stupid as to not see what you are doing.

nigerose wrote:



love还有情人的意思，这个我没有想到。可能泰戈尔的这句诗句不止一种解释，这也是语法不确定性所达到的效果。