| Pages in topic: < [1 2 3] > | Poll: Mostly, you would like your clients to understand... Thread poster: ProZ.com Staff
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inkweaver 
Germany
Local time: 22:05
French to German
+ ...
... that a good translation has its price
... that being native in a certain language doesn't mean that you're an expert on all subjects one can possibly think of
... that translators do indeed have private lives which includes the right to be unavailable for whatever reason
... that I do think it's a matter of courtesy to pay on time when you get your translations delivered on time or even well before the deadline
... that translation is not a commodity that you can sel... See more ... that a good translation has its price
... that being native in a certain language doesn't mean that you're an expert on all subjects one can possibly think of
... that translators do indeed have private lives which includes the right to be unavailable for whatever reason
... that I do think it's a matter of courtesy to pay on time when you get your translations delivered on time or even well before the deadline
... that translation is not a commodity that you can sell by the pound and that a large amount of words to translate doesn't automatically mean that translators should give a discount
I would also like some of our colleagues to understand that we are not beggars and that it is actually harmful to accept lousy conditions. ▲ Collapse
| | | | Anthony Baldwin
United States
Local time: 16:05
Portuguese to English
+ ...
| I concur, but also... | Jun 13, 2016 |
José Henrique Lamensdorf wrote:
1. Translation is a skilled profession, not a hobby.
6. Most banks - at least all that I know of - do not offer translation services. Why should I - as a professional translator - be expected to offer financial services, and get paid for my work many weeks or months later?
7. Both book/magazine publishers and video producers/distributors pulverize the cost of translating into another language among thousands or millions of copies/readers/spectators. If you saw something you liked in a language you don't understand, if it's big enough, the cost of having it translated for you alone may surpass the total cost of taking a course to actually learn that language.
8. DTP is a profession, like translation. If a translator does DTP as well, it is NOT included in the cost of plain text translation.
9. Demanding absolutely any specific CAT tool for no particular reason, just because an advertisement says it delivers better, faster, and cheaper translation is as wise as demanding translators who smoke a particular brand of cigarettes because one of its ads says that smarter people prefer it.
Amen!
And how about:
Yes, I know you want to compete with other agencies for available work, but that has no bearing on the fact that I have bills to pay (I must have electricity and internet access to work with you, no?) and I have a family to feed, and my expenses are rising as quickly as you are trying to lower my wages, so emphatically NO! I can NOT afford to work at half the rate I quoted you.
| | | | | IMO that's a different matter | Jun 13, 2016 |
Anthony Baldwin wrote:
And how about:
Yes, I know you want to compete with other agencies for available work, but that has no bearing on the fact that I have bills to pay (I must have electricity and internet access to work with you, no?) and I have a family to feed, and my expenses are rising as quickly as you are trying to lower my wages, so emphatically NO! I can NOT afford to work at half the rate I quoted you.
This is about the label "translation agency".
There are some that merely resell translation services for profit. The extreme case is what I call "file pushers". If a translator dared to merely rename the source files, that's exactly what the end-client would receive... with an invoice, of course.
When I called the CEO of a large translation agency overseas (attempting to collect my past due payment), he sort of told me that all their marketing relied on low rates and extended payment terms; the clientele they cater to doesn't seem to care about anything else.
Other agencies successfully add value to the deliverables on every order, and serve end-clients who don't compromise on anything, translation included, even if it's not part of their core business.
Agencies supposedly don't have to "understand" that; they wrote it themselves in their own company mission, vision, and values... provided they ever thought about that. File pushers bundle all that into an overarching "let's make some money" approach.
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My agency customers (or clients, I don't know the difference) understand everything, because they have a brain and consist of not-so-perfect human beings just like me.
Those who didn't understand something at my expense at some point are no longer customers.
But good as I am to read between lines and catch any hidden subliminal meaning in my job, I suppose the poll was in fact about any potential translation buyers.
Prospective customers who understa... See more My agency customers (or clients, I don't know the difference) understand everything, because they have a brain and consist of not-so-perfect human beings just like me.
Those who didn't understand something at my expense at some point are no longer customers.
But good as I am to read between lines and catch any hidden subliminal meaning in my job, I suppose the poll was in fact about any potential translation buyers.
Prospective customers who understand that:
- agreed payment terms should be complied with
- rates are MY rates, not theirs
- I translate for a living
- time is money
- I know what I'm doing most of the time
- I can be Superman, but for a bloody high fee to pay for damages from whizzing through the sound barrier
are more likely to become customers than others.
Philippe ▲ Collapse
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Yaotl Altan
Mexico
Local time: 14:05
Member (2006)
English to Spanish
+ ...
| Inflation rate | Jun 13, 2016 |
Ahmad Hosseinzadeh wrote:
I should not lower my rates when the inflation rate is not decreasing in my country!
Hello, Ahmad. How high is the inflation rate in Iran?
| | | | Thayenga
Germany
Local time: 22:05
Member (2009)
English to German
+ ...
Philippe Etienne wrote:
Prospective customers who understand that:
- agreed payment terms should be complied with
- rates are MY rates, not theirs
- I translate for a living
- time is money
- I know what I'm doing most of the time
- I can be Superman, but for a bloody high fee to pay for damages from whizzing through the sound barrier
are more likely to become customers than others.
Philippe
Couldn't have phrased it any better.
Best... "Wonderwoman".
| | | | Anthony Baldwin
United States
Local time: 16:05
Portuguese to English
+ ...
| Oh yes, and... | Jun 14, 2016 |
Everything is a rush job now..
Didn't these people ever learn it's better to start your term paper long before it's due rather than start on it two days before the deadline?
I'm tired of the calls/e-mails, like ,"Anthony...you've got to help us! We have this 12,000 word contract in pdf, half of which is hand-written, and our lawyer needs it in court in English in 3 days!!!! HELP!!!!!! (and because of the volume, we expect a 10% discount".
No...go screw yourself!
Poor Plan... See more Everything is a rush job now..
Didn't these people ever learn it's better to start your term paper long before it's due rather than start on it two days before the deadline?
I'm tired of the calls/e-mails, like ,"Anthony...you've got to help us! We have this 12,000 word contract in pdf, half of which is hand-written, and our lawyer needs it in court in English in 3 days!!!! HELP!!!!!! (and because of the volume, we expect a 10% discount".
No...go screw yourself!
Poor Planning on your part, does not constitute an emergency on my part.
I DO have a life, including a child, and can't just clear my whole life away for you for three days, because you're too stupid to get started on something in a timely manner.
And if I do, you're not only going to pay full price, you're going to pay a premium for the rush, especially if it's in pdf, or includes handwriting.
Am I the only one who's seeing this increasingly (as in a growing trend?) in recent years? ▲ Collapse
| | | | Mario Freitas
Brazil
Local time: 17:05
Member (2014)
English to Portuguese
+ ...
| Mostly, I would love my clients to understand that | Jun 15, 2016 |
- they have to choose between low price and low quality, and decent price and decent quality
- in addition to translating, I also sleep, eat and take a shower every now and then
- I have other clients, not only you
- we are doing business and it's anti-commercial to have to remind you to pay me
- if the reviser changed a word for a synonym, it does not mean my translation was wrong
- they will reduce 30% of their costs if they dismiss the reviser
- there are ... See more - they have to choose between low price and low quality, and decent price and decent quality
- in addition to translating, I also sleep, eat and take a shower every now and then
- I have other clients, not only you
- we are doing business and it's anti-commercial to have to remind you to pay me
- if the reviser changed a word for a synonym, it does not mean my translation was wrong
- they will reduce 30% of their costs if they dismiss the reviser
- there are time zones in this world, that's why I don't reply your e-mails at 3:00 in the morning (my time)
- if there were changes in the original document, I have to be paid proportionally to update the translation
... I could add a thousand items to this list, but I have to go back to work. ▲ Collapse
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| Several things | Jun 23, 2016 |
1. A single word or phrase can have different translations depending on the context. I do not offer discounts for matches of any kind. I believe it's up to me to decide if it should be translated the same way or differently.
2. PDFs, handwriting, and PowerPoint files warrant a surcharge. PPTs are the worst because invariably the translation changes the size of the text box and throws the page out of line, so some handicraft is required to get things back the way they were.
... See more 1. A single word or phrase can have different translations depending on the context. I do not offer discounts for matches of any kind. I believe it's up to me to decide if it should be translated the same way or differently.
2. PDFs, handwriting, and PowerPoint files warrant a surcharge. PPTs are the worst because invariably the translation changes the size of the text box and throws the page out of line, so some handicraft is required to get things back the way they were.
3. Expecting a discount on a large job is crazy. Longer jobs require extra work to maintain consistency of style throughout the text. They seem to think we are sitting there waiting for them to call and we are fortunate to be blessed with a chunk of work. ▲ Collapse
| | | | | Mostly, I would like my clients to understand... | Jun 25, 2016 |
I am not a translator, but translation is part of what we do, and because quality is so important to us, we try to find the best translation teams possible. And, personally, I appreciate everything everyone has said in this forum. Quality should be valued because it is a rare commodity. If the agency values their integrity and not embarrassing their own customers with sloppy translations, then they should pay for the expertise and for those many translators who bend over backwards adding sugge... See more I am not a translator, but translation is part of what we do, and because quality is so important to us, we try to find the best translation teams possible. And, personally, I appreciate everything everyone has said in this forum. Quality should be valued because it is a rare commodity. If the agency values their integrity and not embarrassing their own customers with sloppy translations, then they should pay for the expertise and for those many translators who bend over backwards adding suggestions and comments as part of their service.
Anyways, to get to the point..."Mostly, I would like my clients to understand...
...that translation is an "art." It takes a talented individual to not only understand their native language, but also English (as in most cases that is the source language we deal with). Choosing the right words, making the appropriate changes to fit the tone, style, culture, and subject matter of the target language, as well as asking for clarification if something doesn't make sense...it's all part and parcel of translation. I wish my clients would understand that it's not as easy as it seems, that it takes days and sometimes weeks to prepare even simple translation. And even then, the client's native speaker may make their own changes. I wish my clients would understand that English is by far the worst to translate with all our funny phrases and slang (for instance, "get me your John Hancock and then we'll go shoot the breeze for an hour or so). And I wish they would understand that quality cannot be hurried...
Okay, I'm off my soapbox now. Thanks for letting me vent! : ) ▲ Collapse
| | | | Peter Mueller
Germany
Local time: 22:05
Member (2008)
English to German
| A word on crappy agency systems | Jun 25, 2016 |
I painfully know a lot of what has been written by experience. One issue I would like to add...
Do translation agencies ever run tests of their ”great new job portals" with real translators doing real work? A growing trend seems to be to set up a machine to handle jobs and invoices in software that is super user-unfriendly and unintuitive – everything that marks badly done software.
With one agency, a major player in the business, I spent one hour (by the cl... See more I painfully know a lot of what has been written by experience. One issue I would like to add...
Do translation agencies ever run tests of their ”great new job portals" with real translators doing real work? A growing trend seems to be to set up a machine to handle jobs and invoices in software that is super user-unfriendly and unintuitive – everything that marks badly done software.
With one agency, a major player in the business, I spent one hour (by the clock!) to send my invoice. This included reading through help files, scratching my head over their portal, watching a video and waiting for an email to be allowed to file my invoice.
Others want me to translate online on their systems, another trend. This means I get disowned of my translation memories, i. e my capital. Generally those systems are less efficient than standard translation tools, proprietary and thus require extra time to learn. And if my internet connection is flakey or the server is down I may not even be able to work.
[Bearbeitet am 2016-06-25 19:58 GMT] ▲ Collapse
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The clients would understand that fuzzy matches in 95 to 99 % range do not automatically means less work and thus less money for the translator. I came recently across a really bad scenario: a "small translation" of 200 words and, something the client failed to mention clearly, approximately 5500 xml tags that had to be entered manually.
The other thing I would like the clients to understand is the necessity of providing up to date TM's, not one that provide 3 different translations... See more The clients would understand that fuzzy matches in 95 to 99 % range do not automatically means less work and thus less money for the translator. I came recently across a really bad scenario: a "small translation" of 200 words and, something the client failed to mention clearly, approximately 5500 xml tags that had to be entered manually.
The other thing I would like the clients to understand is the necessity of providing up to date TM's, not one that provide 3 different translations for the same term. ▲ Collapse
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| Other -urgency fees | Jun 26, 2016 |
I'd like my clients to stop trying to get their translations done "as soon as posible" but without paying the "urgent" surcharge just because they don't mention the word "urgent". When I ask back what does "asap" mean, it turns out that it is, in fact urgent. Or sometimes, not all that urgent when they realize I'm not about to forgoe the extra fee.
| | | | | volume discounts | Jun 29, 2016 |
I see a lot of comments on "no discount for large volumes" above, but I'd like to put a few counter-arguments:
- My "admin" costs for a job (set-up, invoicing etc.) are basically the same regardless of the size. For the same reason, I have a minimum charge*.
- A large job means you don't have to actively look for work for a week or three.
- As you progress through a large job, familiarity with the source material grows, and the translation becomes easier (usually).... See more I see a lot of comments on "no discount for large volumes" above, but I'd like to put a few counter-arguments:
- My "admin" costs for a job (set-up, invoicing etc.) are basically the same regardless of the size. For the same reason, I have a minimum charge*.
- A large job means you don't have to actively look for work for a week or three.
- As you progress through a large job, familiarity with the source material grows, and the translation becomes easier (usually).
- With a large job, you have more time to think over any difficult words or phrases, in order to get the best translation. That "oh, of course!" moment.
So generally I will offer some kind of discount for a job that lasts for well over a week. No more than 5% or so.
Of course, your experience may be different.
Cheerio,
Chris.
(*I was offered 0.25 hours of revision the other week, which I turned down without even looking at the source, because the amount would have been too small even to cover the admin costs.) ▲ Collapse
| | | | | Commercial awareness | Jun 30, 2016 |
I maintain my calendar in Proz for a reason - supply and demand works both ways - I'm not short of work - the calendar is a big clue
hence - I don't appreciate agencies that I have had no experience of working with spamming my inbox with insulting job offers - rush jobs - tight deadlines in a highly specialist area, but without rates to reflect it.
Likewise offers for jobs outside my subject specialism.
I don't waste time replying (apart from my standard auto-rep... See more I maintain my calendar in Proz for a reason - supply and demand works both ways - I'm not short of work - the calendar is a big clue
hence - I don't appreciate agencies that I have had no experience of working with spamming my inbox with insulting job offers - rush jobs - tight deadlines in a highly specialist area, but without rates to reflect it.
Likewise offers for jobs outside my subject specialism.
I don't waste time replying (apart from my standard auto-reply), but I resent even the time it takes me to scan and delete these messages.
I don't waste time quoting for big (speculative) jobs for agencies that I do not already have a working relationship with. And why should I quote a particularly low rate for said agency who does not have sufficient existing in-house resources to put a bid together, only for them to undercut another agency that I'm likely already working with?
Just like supply and demand, performance management works both ways
I work with a large number of agencies/project managers and I keep notes on them
persistently low offers send you to the bottom of my list
prompt purchase orders/payment and friendly communications sends you to the top of my list when you're looking for someone to help out on an urgent job ▲ Collapse
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