| Pages in topic: < [1 2 3] > | how to protect oneself from non paying clients-advice needed Thread poster: Luke Mersh
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Inga Petkelyte 
Portugal
Local time: 21:30
Lithuania menyang Portugis
+ ...
| What about a call? | Aug 10, 2015 |
Sometimes a real, human voice makes miracles.
An do, there is no way tto protect yourself 100%. I guess, no busines in any area has such protection.
But try calling. Good luck.
| | | | Luke Mersh
United Kingdom
Local time: 21:30
Spanyol menyang Inggris
TOPIC STARTER
@Inga.
This is true, but can be costly when the agency is in another country.
many thanks.
| | | | Dan Lucas
United Kingdom
Local time: 21:30
Member (2014)
Jepang menyang Inggris
| Pay for a proper service | Aug 10, 2015 |
Luke Mersh wrote:
What can I do to prevent this from happening again, work is very difficult to come by.
I have now created a PO which they have to sign and send back, but even this does not stop them from not paying.
People like the ones you describe knowingly prey on people like you.
Here's how to avoid predators.
1) Do not deal with agencies based in developing countries or any other countries where it is - in practical terms - impossible to use the law to force non-payers to pay. I do not deal with agencies in China or India for that reason. I'm sure there are some very ethical and professional firms in those countries, but it is hard to ascertain this beforehand. Plus, agencies from those countries tend not to pay sensible rates.
2) Do not trust the Blue Board alone because translators do not always say what they really think. I think it is a useful resource, but even a long string of 5s does not mean the agency is a good customer. Conversely, if there are more than a couple of rankings of below 5 you should immediately be extremely cautious and cross-check with another service.
3) Do be wary if the comments on the Blue Board are mostly from translators based in developing countries and if there are very few comments from translators in developed economies. A preponderance of developing country translators strongly suggests that the rates being offered are too low to attract professionals from developed nations and that you are wasting your time.
4) Do find additional resources. Google 'translation agencies payment reputation' or similar phrases to find other, paid services that advise on whether an agency is reliable or not. I think the service I use costs me $25 a year and I use it for every new client that contacts me or that I consider contacting. I'm astonished that some (most?) translators take on thousands of dollars worth of business without checking the background of their client. That is naiive in the extreme.
5) Do immediately put a small claims court procedure in motion (easy in the UK and Europe and perhaps the US also?) if it looks like a client is not going to pay, just to show them that you're serious. If a non-paying agency owes money to several translators who are doing nothing except sending unhappy emails and one translator who is threatening legal action, they will pay the one threatening legal action. When you get your money, report them on the Blue Board, on other services (see above) and never deal with them again.
6) Finally, and most difficult of all, do try to avoid sounding or seeming desperate for work. People can smell that and they will take advantage of you. Accept only those jobs that are worth taking. If you inquire about a low-paying job it suggests that you're struggling to stay afloat and swimmers thrashing around in the water attract sharks. You don't want that. Take another part-time job to support yourself until the translation takes off, hone your skills, but don't take projects from bottom feeders.
Regards
Dan
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Dan Lucas wrote:
swimmers thrashing around in the water attract sharks
Love the analogy - very accurate as regards our industry. Wise words Dan - you certainly brightened my Monday!
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| On phone calls - Skype | Aug 10, 2015 |
Inga Petkelyte wrote:
Sometimes a real, human voice makes miracles.
An do, there is no way to protect yourself 100%. I guess, no busines in any area has such protection.
But try calling. Good luck.
Luke Mersh wrote:
@Inga.
This is true, but can be costly when the agency is in another country.
many thanks.
Luke, have you ever tried Skype?
Installation is free, but you can have SkypeOut for a prepayment of USD/EUR 10. Then an international call to a phone anywhere will cost next to nothing.
For instance, I checked in your currency, if I had to call a landline in England from here - Sao Paulo, Brazil - it would cost me a £ 3.1p connection fee + £ 1.4p per minute. Hence if you had defaulted on my payment, I could pester you for an entire hour spending less than £1!
Furthermore, Skype-to-Skype voice/IM connections are completely free. It's a valuable tool for quick communication with my clients who have it too.
http://www.skype.com
| | | | Luke Mersh
United Kingdom
Local time: 21:30
Spanyol menyang Inggris
TOPIC STARTER
Dear colleagues.
I am pleased to announce that the company finally did pay me.
I just had to go to my bank account to check something and found that the payment had been received.
13 days overdue, but received all the same
| | | | | 13 days overdue? Seems "next to nothing" to me? | Aug 10, 2015 |
Did they then pay 43 days after the invoice date or 73? (your term of payment + 13 days or theirs)
I was thinking they were "a lot more" days overdue... Ofcourse it would have been better if they actually would have paid on time.
If your client is based in another country, it also takes a couple of days for the banks to do what they are supposed to do...
In Belgium between two different banks it can already take three working days.
But hey: congratulations on get... See more Did they then pay 43 days after the invoice date or 73? (your term of payment + 13 days or theirs)
I was thinking they were "a lot more" days overdue... Ofcourse it would have been better if they actually would have paid on time.
If your client is based in another country, it also takes a couple of days for the banks to do what they are supposed to do...
In Belgium between two different banks it can already take three working days.
But hey: congratulations on getting paid! ▲ Collapse
| | | | Luke Mersh
United Kingdom
Local time: 21:30
Spanyol menyang Inggris
TOPIC STARTER
@Nele
We both agreed on 30 day payment.
I finished the project ahead of time and invoiced them, the deadline came and went, and was told they were looking into the problem and would get paid; I had actually written it off.
But they were 13 days overdue on the agreed date.
regards
Luke
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Kevin Fulton
United States
Local time: 16:30
Jerman menyang Inggris
| Payment cycles | Aug 10, 2015 |
As another colleague pointed out, a 13-day delay in payment is nothing.
Another thing to keep in mind is that agencies deal with a large number of translators submitting invoices at random times during the month. For organizational reasons, many, if not most companies (and not just translation agencies) have instituted payment cycles, that is they only pay invoices at certain times of the month. I'm familiar with several agencies that pay twice a month, on the 15th and 30th. When th... See more As another colleague pointed out, a 13-day delay in payment is nothing.
Another thing to keep in mind is that agencies deal with a large number of translators submitting invoices at random times during the month. For organizational reasons, many, if not most companies (and not just translation agencies) have instituted payment cycles, that is they only pay invoices at certain times of the month. I'm familiar with several agencies that pay twice a month, on the 15th and 30th. When the vendor gets paid depends on when in the cycle the invoice is received, so potentially an invoice submitted on the 10th of the month might not be paid until the 15th of the following month, for example.
The other thing to keep in mind is that banks like to take advantage of the "float", that is, delaying transactions for a day or two before transferring funds or crediting them to your account. In my experience, foreign transactions can take as much as 5 days before payment is credited to my account in the US, since each bank in the process sits on the money for a day or two before transferring it. ▲ Collapse
| | | | | 13 days - nothing to worry about | Aug 10, 2015 |
Although I do not like being paid late, 13 days is not much, I'd really worry after 30 days and having sent a reminder or two...
| | | | Luke Mersh
United Kingdom
Local time: 21:30
Spanyol menyang Inggris
TOPIC STARTER
Maybe next time if they contact me again, which is doubtful, I should offer them 45 days??
many thanks
| | | | Sheila Wilson
Spain
Local time: 21:30
Member (2007)
Inggris
+ ...
| Last resort only | Aug 10, 2015 |
Luke Mersh wrote:
I had actually written it off.
But they were 13 days overdue on the agreed date.
You shouldn't do that at such an early stage. It's bad for your bank balance, bad for your self-respect, and bad for all of us, your peers. It gives a clear sign to poor agencies that they can get translations for free. Each agency who gets away with it once is going to stall that bit longer the next time in the hope of getting another one free.
Of course, there are times when there is no alternative, such as when a company has filed for bankruptcy and the receiver can't find enough cash to pay you. I've lost two sums of around EUR 400 that way . It's also possible for beginners to get scammed, though there are measures in place here on ProZ.com to reduce that risk, and scams are something that you become pretty good at sniffing out. There can come a time, I suppose, when it just becomes uneconomic to chase a payment any longer. If you've sent a registered final demand, got a lawyer to dash out another on his/her very official stationery, prepared a submission to the relevant Small Claims Court (if appropriate), posted negative feedback everywhere, e-mailed and rung them repeatedly, etc, etc then you may be close to the point of giving up. However, all the measures you should be taking to recover your debt would normally take at least six months. In over 15 years freelancing, I've written off just one debt apart from the two mentioned above - EUR 12.50 (!) owed by a fellow freelancer whose business was clearly failing and I really wanted out as I'm not a social worker or psychologist.
Write off too many debts, too quickly, and your tax authorities may well start asking questions.
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Thank for these fresh ideas.
| | | | Bernhard Sulzer
United States
Local time: 16:30
Inggris menyang Jerman
+ ...
| Another fresh idea | Aug 11, 2015 |
You lay down the payments terms, including by what date payment must be received.
If you don't get paid by then, your terms have not been fulfilled. You tell the client that payment is overdue and that you need to receive the payment asap.
Respect has been lost.
If you let them pay whenever they want, you are the one who seems desperate. They'll do it again and again.
Why should they be able to not stick to the terms when you did when you delivered o... See more You lay down the payments terms, including by what date payment must be received.
If you don't get paid by then, your terms have not been fulfilled. You tell the client that payment is overdue and that you need to receive the payment asap.
Respect has been lost.
If you let them pay whenever they want, you are the one who seems desperate. They'll do it again and again.
Why should they be able to not stick to the terms when you did when you delivered on time?
Time to move on. ▲ Collapse
| | | | Bernhard Sulzer
United States
Local time: 16:30
Inggris menyang Jerman
+ ...
| Don't let them play their game | Aug 11, 2015 |
Luke Mersh wrote:
Maybe next time if they contact me again, which is doubtful, I should offer them 45 days??
many thanks
So you get paid after 58 days?
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