| Pages in topic: < [1 2 3] > | PM salary in Argentina (inhouse position) Thread poster: Fernando Tognis
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| What Gabriela meant | Jul 30, 2009 |
Aniello Scognamiglio wrote: Dear Gabriela, you are comparing apples with pears. A PM is an employee (salary!). A freelancer runs a business! The sky is the limit  Best, Aniello
Hi, Aniello.
I´m not Gabriela, but I´m sure she meant "inhouse translators" working at the agency.
Best,
Lorena
[Edited at 2009-07-30 14:51 GMT]
| | | | Fernando Tognis 
Argentina
Local time: 17:35
Member (2006)
Spanish to English
+ ...
TOPIC STARTER | I agree with you | Jul 30, 2009 |
Daiana Couyet wrote: "as a PM I was all day long chasing deadlines, arguing about quality issues, unsatisfied customers, lost assignments, etc, ANYTHING except translating!  " Once I left the agency I realized that I have earned almost nothing, I knew a lot of clients and agencies, but they were the customers of this agency, so I though it was unethical for me to contact them offering my translation services. In my first week as a freelance translator I earned the same amount of money I used to make as a PM in a whole month, but working from home, with my dog at one side and a cup of coffee at the other, doing what I love.
Regardless of the salary figures, I would not like to do more admin work than translating, researching and learning new subjects. Furthermore, I love working from home, having breakfast during the first working hour in the morning, while I organize my day. Then I may take a break to have lunch AT HOME instead of ordering food to be delivered at the office or eating at noisy and crowded bars.
| | | | | local customers-local rates / int'l customers-int'l rates | Jul 30, 2009 |
Mauricio Manzo wrote:
6) Fixed salary remuneration should be compared to the average remuneration in the respective country (as that is where a person is hired, gets paid, pays his or her rent etc.). You wouldn’t go to a doctor in Argentina and tell him he’s earning money at “sweatshop” rates, because his colleagues in the U.S. earn more.
I think we're really comparing apples to pears.
Local customers pay local rates, but international customers certainly pay international rates.
If, as Fernando mentions, their list of clients contains very important companies (multinational companies?), there is a big spread between what the end-client pays and what in-house translators/ PMs/ freelancers may receive.
Somebody is doing big business here, I guess.
mm
| | | | Fernando Tognis
Argentina
Local time: 17:35
Member (2006)
Spanish to English
+ ...
TOPIC STARTER | Considering advantages and disadvantages | Jul 30, 2009 |
[quote]Valeria Verona wrote:
Fer
I agree with Mauricio. The analysis below is quite accurate. Take into account that you get things provided for, paid vacations and leaves, fixed schedule (no working at night and weekends), security (you don't take business risk and you get paid no matter what every month), other costs that you are now bearing (monotributo/autónomos, medical insurance, collections management, bank transfers/checks, delinquent payers).
Only taking into account the amount is an incomplete analysis in my view.
HTH.
Rgds,
Vale
[quote]
Thanks Valeria. I agree with you on mentioning all the advantages of in-house positions. However, as an in-house PM, I would have to bear other costs. For instance, I would have to order food and drinks or eat at bars or restaurants (the average cost is $20 a day, or 400 pesos a month). Furthermore, if I worked 9 hours in an office I would not like to arrive home and do all my housework and cook dinner, so I would have to hire someone to do that. With the same figure, I can pay my own holidays, monotributo and medical insurance.
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| You must be joking... | Jul 30, 2009 |
Mauricio Manzo wrote:
5) The remuneration I mentioned on my previous comment seems fine to me for someone who does not have previous experience in being a Project Manager.
6) Fixed salary remuneration should be compared to the average remuneration in the respective country (as that is where a person is hired, gets paid, pays his or her rent etc.). You wouldn’t go to a doctor in Argentina and tell him he’s earning money at “sweatshop” rates, because his colleagues in the U.S. earn more.
We are not talking about salaries in the U.S., we're considering what should be a decent salary in Argentina. Obviously, AR$2,500 is an insulting figure for anyone working as a PM --not to mention those figures paid to inhouse translators, the lady who is now cleaning my house earns more than that!
If you investigate a bit on current salaries in Argentina you'll be so surprised... I have too many examples from people around me earning way more than AR$ 2,500 without any experience or studies (and yes! they have vacations, insurance and all that!! Wow!).
Is it that the translation industry pays much less than all other industries? Of course not! It's so easy to see who's getting richer and richer every day with these insulting salaries. Please, open your eyes!!
| | | | | Don't agree with you | Jul 30, 2009 |
Mauricio Manzo wrote:
You wouldn’t go to a doctor in Argentina and tell him he’s earning money at “sweatshop” rates, because his colleagues in the U.S. earn more.
The problem is that in Argentina there are many agencies that want to pay half of what is suggested by the Colegios de Traductores. Besides, they export their services at an international price and their earnings are in euros or dollars. I am not talking about small agencies, but about those that organize international events and sell themselves as serious companies abroad…
| | | | Daiana Siri
Argentina
Local time: 17:35
English to Spanish
Fernando Tognis wrote:
Thanks Valeria. I agree with you on mentioning all the advantages of in-house positions. However, as an in-house PM, I would have to bear other costs. For instance, I would have to order food and drinks or eat at bars or restaurants (the average cost is $20 a day, or 400 pesos a month). Furthermore, if I worked 9 hours in an office I would not like to arrive home and do all my housework and cook dinner, so I would have to hire someone to do that. With the same figure, I can pay my own holidays, monotributo and medical insurance.
In fact, you will end up losing money and with small chances of progress, no matter how hard you work, the salary is always the same.
As Aniello said, as a freelancer you run your own business and the sky is the limit. The harder you work, the more you earn.
Besides all the other advantages you already mentioned (being at home, no commuting, having your breakfast during the first hour of the morning while organizing your day) no running late, not chasing trains, busses, etc!
| | | | | Not THAT bad!! | Jul 31, 2009 |
Daiana Couyet wrote:
In fact, you will end up losing money and with small chances of progress, no matter how hard you work, the salary is always the same.
Hmz, don't get too pessimistic there. Looking back at my career so far I feel I've made quite some progress, and looking forward I know there's more to come. Being a PM is not a total hell, and, let's face it, being a freelancer surely isn't always heaven either.
Benefits and advantages to both, like with everything. Up to you to weigh them!
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Daiana Siri
Argentina
Local time: 17:35
English to Spanish
I am sorry Susan, you are right, when I consider the pros and the cons I’ll rather stay where I am, but I am quite sure that being a PM surely has a lot of rewards.
Just like you said, being a freelancer is not always heaven! Actually, sometimes is bit frustrating, it is a lonely job (I wish my dog would talk!) and chasing some customers with remainders about their payments isn’t heaven… at all!!
Anyway, I don’t think there is a “perfect” job  ... See more I am sorry Susan, you are right, when I consider the pros and the cons I’ll rather stay where I am, but I am quite sure that being a PM surely has a lot of rewards.
Just like you said, being a freelancer is not always heaven! Actually, sometimes is bit frustrating, it is a lonely job (I wish my dog would talk!) and chasing some customers with remainders about their payments isn’t heaven… at all!!
Anyway, I don’t think there is a “perfect” job 
Cheers!
Di ▲ Collapse
| | | | | Not the same kind of managers | Jul 31, 2009 |
Marcela Mestre wrote:
Hi Fernando,
Sorry for posting in Spanish. This was published in Clarín - Economics - page 20, on Sunday 26th of July. It might give you an idea.
Average monthly salary for heads and managers, according to department. In-house PMs are, as its name indicates, managers:
Jefe de ventas: 11.151 ARS (es el más alto)
Jefe de RR.HH: 9.448 ARS
Jefe de asuntos legales: 8060 ARS (es el más bajo)
Gerente comercial: 25.739 ARS (es el más alto)
Gerente de RR.HH.: 19.164 ARS
Gerente de logística: 18.004 ARS (es el más bajo)
El estudio fue realizado por la consultora especializada HuCap, exclusivo para IEco, y relevó 86 empresas, entre grandes, medianas y pequeñas, durante el mes de mayo.
Hope it helps.
Best.
mm
[Edited at 2009-07-29 11:40 GMT]
Hi Marcela,
I am afraid that project managers do not belong to the kind of managers included in that survey. Logistics managers, human resources managers, etc. are functional managers and they manage areas of a company. Project managers, on the other hand, are managers of their projects and don't have such a high rank in the hierarchical structure of the company.
Regards,
Enrique
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Enrique wrote:
Project managers, on the other hand, are managers of their projects and don't have such a high rank in the hierarchical structure of the company.
Do you really think they are not that important/ hierarchical? Aren't they to blame for almost everything that goes wrong with a client?
mm
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Marcela Mestre wrote: Enrique wrote:
Project managers, on the other hand, are managers of their projects and don't have such a high rank in the hierarchical structure of the company.
Do you really think they are not that important/ hierarchical? Aren't they to blame for almost everything that goes wrong with a client?
I worked for several years as Project Manager (not in relation with translations). It is a very demanding job (but a fascinating one). PM's are not part of the company's management (maybe in a very small company a high-ranked person can play also the role of PM).
Enrique
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| Anyway, would You? | Jul 31, 2009 |
Enrique wrote:
I worked for several years as Project Manager (not in relation with translations). It is a very demanding job (but a fascinating one). PM's are not part of the company's management (maybe in a very small company a high-ranked person can play also the role of PM).
Enrique
Enrique,
you live in Argentina and know what it takes to raise a family.
Would you accept a PM job at approx. ARS3,800? Bus drivers, with due respect, earn that much with no qualification.
Would you accept such a job when you know that the company you work for is making a big difference between what it earns in dollars and what it pays in pesos?
Isn't it time we all joined forces?
mm
| | | | | Free distribution list from an association of translators of Buenos Aires | Aug 4, 2009 |
I have been browsing the e-mails I used to receive from (I-don't-know-if-I-can-mention-it-without-breaking-a-rule). I hope you remember it.
In May 1999 (1 dollar = 1 peso) a colleague asked about a PM salary in Argentina. The reply was "over 2500" Ten years ago!
mm
| | | | Fernando Tognis
Argentina
Local time: 17:35
Member (2006)
Spanish to English
+ ...
TOPIC STARTER
Marcela Mestre wrote:
I have been browsing the e-mails I used to receive from (I-don't-know-if-I-can-mention-it-without-breaking-a-rule). I hope you remember it.
In May 1999 (1 dollar = 1 peso) a colleague asked about a PM salary in Argentina. The reply was "over 2500" Ten years ago!
mm
Thanks, Marcela. That figure clearly shows some people are making extra profit out of the hard work of their employees.
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